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Author: Topic: HDV - is the future here?
Stephen Coltrane
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Stephen Coltrane

Posted: Sun, 21 Nov 2004 05:28PM
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Sony is issuing its new Z1E camera in the spring, at about £4000. The HDV tapes will arrive about the same time (the Z1E will shoot onto existing DV tape stock, too). Sony's FX1 camera already allows for the new format although, of course, the tapes are not out yet.

Presumably FCP HD will be able to handle this new format - surely that's the point.

Anyone think this is a future road budget film-makers will want to go down? It does sound too good to be true.

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Author: Topic: Re: HDV - is the future here?
digitalsafari
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digitalsafari

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Posted: Sun, 21 Nov 2004 05:54PM
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Stephen Coltrane,

You can record HDV on DV tapes.

FCP HD 4.5 has native DVCPRO-HD, or uncompressed HD with a suitable HD-SDI card like the DeckLink HD coupled with a fast RAID.

You can use HDV with the current FCP HD by using LumiereHD, this will have full FX-1 support in a few weeks. Currently You can use LumiereHD with the FX-1 for getting material in over Firewire.

Jonathan.


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Author: Topic: Re: HDV - is the future here?
Stephen Coltrane
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Stephen Coltrane

Posted: Mon, 22 Nov 2004 10:35AM
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Jonathan,

Thanks. I knew you could record onto DV tapes, but is there much advantage in upgrading your camera if you're going to be shooting on the same tapes?

Someone else told me about Lumiere. It does sound promising. I hear Apple is working on upgrading FCP to handle HDV, but no news about when.

I wonder what the uptake of HDV will be.

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Author: Topic: Re: HDV - is the future here?
digitalsafari
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digitalsafari

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Posted: Mon, 22 Nov 2004 11:20AM
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Stephen Coltrane,

Your recording a HD HDV recording on a DV tape, not DV video.

Same as recording HD D-VHS onto a S-VHS tape.

The tape is just a transport, it's what you record that makes the difference.


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Author: Topic: Re: HDV - is the future here?
Stephen Coltrane
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Stephen Coltrane

Posted: Tue, 23 Nov 2004 09:18AM
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Jonathan,

Yes, I appreciate there's bound to be some improvement in quality by shooting HD onto a DV tape (although I believe some people dispute this). The point I was trying to make was - shouldn't one wait until the HDV tapes are available before purchasing an HDV camcorder, in order to get the greatest benefit?

And I was wondering what impact the appearance of an affordable HD format (even if it's not the same as 'true' HD) will have on independent film-making. Will it be considered 'good enough' by people who would only have considered HD (or film) before?

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Author: Topic: Re: HDV - is the future here?
MattDavis
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MattDavis

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Posted: Tue, 23 Nov 2004 11:38AM
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If shooting HD, then outputting back to DV, you'll get back all the DV artifacts like low resolution in strong chroma (e.g. stage lighting, chromakey), mosquitos round high contrast areas, bad reaction to high-gain footage, etc. Maybe it would be better to pull it back into SD FCP via analogue S-Video and capturing to DVCPRO50 to retain the sharpness and chroma detail.

When it comes to HDV *tapes*, AFAIK, it may be just to do with lubrication and drop-out proofing (also known as "marketing"?) in, I guess, much the same way as purchasing DVCAM tapes instead of using MiniDV cassettes.

It will be down to the brave to try it out.

BTW, don't forget that HDV audio is compressed as well as video, and that the data rate is *less* than DV - so the issue is whether MPEG-2 provides a cleaner result on a 1920x1080 image than DV25 does at 720x576 at near-equivalent bitrates. Assume that i-frame/p-frame/gop nonsense is cleared up by transcoding (as in Lumiere-HD) or by as yet unidentified magic in the HDV compliant FCP.

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Author: Topic: Re: HDV - is the future here?
Stephen Coltrane
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Stephen Coltrane

Posted: Thu, 02 Dec 2004 02:49PM
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There's a message in today's Shooting People bulletin, raving about the forthcoming Z1 and all the advantages it has over even the FX1. It's too lengthy to quote in detail, but you can read it if you go to www.shootingpeople.org (you'll have to wait a few days if you're not a SP member).

The author's argument is that the Z1 delivers many extras on top of the FX1 which make the extra GBP1000 or so outlay worth it. To summarise, he lists both PAL and NTSC DV and DVCAM as well as HDV, SMPTE professional timecode features, improve audio setups, and "a whole host of colour, gamma and pedestal settings" to name just a few.

Capping his evangelical zeal are remarks like, "This will be the biggest shock to the acquisition side of the industry since the discovery of fire" and "The so called fringe, alternative, low-budget, wacky etc., bit of the so-called 'industry' is about to enter a most exciting and empowering phase of development."

Even granting that he seems to have quite a chip on his shoulder, it's difficult not to be persuaded by his enthusiasm. Anyone know a counter argument?

(I'm asking because the Z1 might be within my budget, and I shall want to think about a new camera next year...)

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Author: Topic: Re: HDV - is the future here?
shillndd
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Posted: Thu, 09 Dec 2004 01:44PM
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Stephen Coltrane,

Wait until late next year - very late - I know nothing of the subject, but my experience with all things new is to wait until the dust settles. Unless of course you can afford to take the chance and shrug it off.

steve Hill

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Author: Topic: Re: HDV - is the future here?
Stephen Coltrane
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Stephen Coltrane

Posted: Sat, 11 Dec 2004 11:25AM
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Steve,

Actually, I think that's exactly what I'll be doing. In the meantime, it'll be a good old DV camera for me. At least I'll have something decent to shoot with.

(But should it be the new XL2, or something older? Oh, dear...)

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Author: Topic: Re: HDV - is the future here?
shillndd
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Posted: Sat, 11 Dec 2004 09:03PM
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Stephen Coltrane,

Something older methinks. When I worked for Biographic Cartoons Bob Godfrey used what was almost a handcranker - a marvellous polished wood and brass job - Now that's what you need.

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Author: Topic: Re: HDV - is the future here?
Stephen Coltrane
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Stephen Coltrane

Posted: Sun, 12 Dec 2004 12:32PM
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shillndd,

Maybe a magic lantern?

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